Level Editor Suggestions

You are viewing a static copy of the old 2DBoy forum, which closed in 2010. It is preserved here for historical interest, but it is not possible to reply to topics. For more recent discussion about World of Goo, visit our new forum.
Level Editor SuggestionsDil99904/11/2008 - 01:52

I know you eventually want to add a level editor to the game.  I was wondering today what the best way to do this would be, since many of the levels are oddly shaped.  I thought the best way was to do something like the level creator in the XBLA game N+ (a great game, if you haven't played it yet you should). 
You have a choice of many small, generic building blocks, which you can place together to make structures- attached are some examples.

Additionally, for spawning Goo Balls, you would be able to select any goo ball, and place it anywhere you want on the level.  By double clicking on a spawned object, you can change its values (for example, you could spawn 1 goo ball, double-click, and then select an option that multiplies it into ten)
You could also create spinning blades (which destroy goo balls), water (everything below a certain height is water), spikes (pop balloons when facing downwards and kill goo balls when facing upwards), gates (that you must attach goo balls to in order to move), and spinning objects, like in the last level of chapter 1.  For the two objects, after spawning, you could use options to change how large they are and many other options, such as if certain ones destroy goo balls or just detach them, etc.

Re: Level Editor SuggestionsBallisticsfood04/11/2008 - 05:17

Another way to do it, instead of using a tile based editor like N or Gish, would be to use drag and drop placement of visual elements. For example, a user creates an image/animation to be part of their level and puts it in the Level designer folder. In the level editor, they can then select that image and place it wherever they like. Then they can edit it's properties, like friction, whether it kills or not, whether gooballs stick or not ETC. If you coupled that with layers (background, interactive, and foreground) people would be able to make pretty and functional levels in any shape/visual style they want. Add to that an objects list (the images were purely for background) that contains goo, boxes, connection points, doors, stuff like that, and a way to set the water level, and you've got a first class level editor.

Of course, both ideas so far are pure speculation as to what a level editor might be... No-one really knows...

Re: Level Editor SuggestionsWiggles05/10/2008 - 18:54

[quote author=Ballisticsfood link=topic=89.msg709#msg709 date=1207909060]Another way to do it, instead of using a tile based editor like N or Gish, would be to use drag and drop placement of visual elements. For example, a user creates an image/animation to be part of their level and puts it in the Level designer folder. In the level editor, they can then select that image and place it wherever they like. Then they can edit it's properties, like friction, whether it kills or not, whether gooballs stick or not ETC. If you coupled that with layers (background, interactive, and foreground) people would be able to make pretty and functional levels in any shape/visual style they want. Add to that an objects list (the images were purely for background) that contains goo, boxes, connection points, doors, stuff like that, and a way to set the water level, and you've got a first class level editor.

Of course, both ideas so far are pure speculation as to what a level editor might be... No-one really knows...Yes.  Much better than tiles.  We should be able to make levels of the same quality as the levels in the game.

Pre-made objects would make it easy for people that are not so computer-savy to create levels also.

Re: Level Editor Suggestionsrednay05/11/2008 - 01:55

a level editor would be great. but I dont think it'll be in the game. :P

Re: Level Editor SuggestionsYgrecs10/18/2008 - 05:57

Yes, it would be really important to add e level editor. This game is perfect for that. It would a lot of fun and lifetime to this game. We could share these levels by the internet.
Youb must do en editor, please.

Re: Level Editor SuggestionsCrazynoodle10/18/2008 - 07:03

A level editor would be cool, but u have 2 be able 2 share them via enternet :)

Re: Level Editor Suggestionsl3illyl3ob10/18/2008 - 12:00

Level editors are fantastic for these sorts of games.  I really hope 2dboy makes one.

Also a couple of my friends balked at the idea of buying this game because it didn't have a level editor. I had to placate them by telling them that one would be released down the line.  You must deliver on my false promises!

Re: Level Editor Suggestionswarrscott10/19/2008 - 12:07

Level editors are the future of gaming: I think in a few years it will be as odd for a game to not have a level editor as it is to find a single player only game now. Lots of games now come with world class editors (far cry/boom blox), and some games like little big planet are basically built around players being able to create and edit their own levels.

Yet out of all of the games I've played, I think none scream for a level editor more than World of Goo: I got WoG for wii, absolutely love it, and wish to high heaven it had an editor.

I really like Ballistic's idea of an editor, something that allows users to include their own graphics and properties. In addition to just sharing your levels over the internet (which is pretty much a given guys, so you don't have to worry about that being a feature or not), this kind of editor would also allow you to share pre-fabbed level objects over the internet as well. So if scripting was a little too difficult for some users to figure out, they would have a whole host of pre-built objects in the editor (like the blocks, spikes, cogs, gates, etc.) to use, and could download additional objects people upload, with images and simple descriptions (i.e. "this giant bomb will explode if fire touches it's wick, and it will roll on an uneven surface... you can change the size and weight of the ball, and size of explosion"). Then people would download the object, import it into their scene, and there you have it. Additionally, for basic terrain you could have simple painting tools, like the Worms games have offered for years -- you paint and erase a basic 2d structure, then apply a theme to it. With something simple like that to begin with, and then pre-built objects on top that are interactive and animated, gamers could build pretty awesome levels that could possibly be as good as the levels included in the game.

One more advanced option that would make the WoG level editor one of the best editors of all time, is to include a goo editor, as JossiRossi commented in another suggestion. This could allow users to make superficial changes to goo (i.e. change the color, size, speed, weight), and mechanics of goo, (i.e. connection strength, attaching properties, etc.). This would really open up gameplay possibilities, giving the game unlimited replay value. Even if a goo editor would be less user friendly and require some real scripting knowledge, no doubt there would be dedicated fans of the game who would be willing to help people bring their ideas to life (i.e. "I want to make a concrete goo, that is light when he's moving around the structure, but when you place him he becomes very heavy and rock solid..."). Even if the average user couldn't do more than change the color of the goo balls by himself, it would still allow him to download other edited goos from more programming savvy players (i.e. "here is my recently updated concrete goo ball: now when there is too much stress on him you can see cracks and dust clouds form before he breaks...").

Well, that is my dream for an editor -- I know it is far-fetched, but when you look at some game creator software that is out there now, and the communities that have been born out of them... it's really amazing what people can do when supplied with some very basic tools. I hope 2dboy considers creating a level editor, and being really open with the process, allowing their fans some access into the physics and scripting of the game: with the ability to make unique objects, customized goo balls, and to share that kind of user content, the next iteration of WoG could really revolutionize what is expected from a level editor, and what is expected from a game developer ;D...

...oh, and thanks 2dboy, for such a truly awesome game!!!

Re: Level Editor SuggestionsMarius10/19/2008 - 13:35

*mentally jots down

Re: Level Editor SuggestionsMallin10/23/2008 - 16:09

I would like to add that, if the editor was well done, and offered a real ability to create any level you can imagine, and was backed up by a way to trade and upload and download new levels right in the game with little hassle, (and work with the WiiWare version) then I would be willing to pay for it as if it where an entirely new game.

Re: Level Editor Suggestionswarrscott10/28/2008 - 19:30

That is also the great thing about a digital release: it's not as final as someone buying a DVD. If the wii version of WoG is currently coded in a way that doesn't allow for updates, they can always offer a new replacement version for people to download. They're not bound by their customers being stuck with an unchangeable DVD! :)

However, I think 2DBoy's main focus should be making a PC editor: the kind of customization I and others mentioned would have to be done on a PC, where people can import their own images, script, etc., and be able to grow a community for user content, which a console simply can't handle. The editor probably wouldn't even be part of the game, but rather standalone software, like Valve's editor Hammer, or Unreal Tournament's UnrealED: true development tools. With that WoG fans could create their own levels and output them as files, then import them into whichever version they like.  It might sound like a lot of work for a niche audience (since everyone wouldn't even want to try making their own levels), but if made correctly, and customizable enough, it could become the tool 2DBoy uses to make their own levels as well, which is how the above editors work. By the time 2DBoy was done tweaking the editor, they'd probably have a couple dozen really awesome levels, which could be released, along with the new import functionality, as WoG 2 ;)

So, they could make a world class editor which would make it easier for them to make their own levels, which would garner them unbelievable praise from critics and gamers, which would spur endless user created content and unlimited replay value, and enough of their own content to make a full blooded sequel to showcase it all. Hey, this is sounding less like a crazy dream and more like good business sense -- got a job position for me 2DBoy  ;D?